(unknown charset) Re: [BLACKBOX] Separated subsystems misunderstanding

From: (unknown charset) unknown charset <no email>
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 09:27:48 +0300

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I hope you do not think that module in BlackBox is
loading "as is" without scope of dependencies. If you
look closer at StdLoader you can find the code thats checks
availability of imported modules, else it raises up an loading error.

Yes, the scope of modules is still can be "compiled",
"dinamicaly loaded and unloaded". By the way, strictly philosophicaly,
i can't see any reason for naming one entity by two different names.
And the definition you provided doesn't shows us such reason.

However, "O3" prefix is the valid way to define semantic relations of
subsystems,
without need to think up your own beautiful name.
And it still satisfies the naming convention of BlackBox.


On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 04:50:01 +0300, Douglas G. Danforth
<danforth{([at]})nowhere.xy

> Interesting.
> So we come down to the definition of a 'component'.
>
> From the BB documentation I find (from Tour Guide)
>
> "various components that provide word processing functionality (Text
> subsystem)"
> and
> "The BlackBox run-time environment supports dynamic linking and loading
> (and
> unloading) of components."
>
> Hence I infer that
> component = (compiled) module
> subsystem = {components} (set of components)
>
> о╦РП , That disagrees with your usage.
> You also say,
>
> "Here we can see that subsystem is collection of components, not modules.
> Actually saying, if there were only modules, it would be forbidden to use
> any dependencies in your own subsystem. "
>
> But I disagree. There is no separate thing called a "component" only
> modules
> that
> are grouped (via naming convention) into a subsystem. A component is a
> concept
> which is physically represented at a (compiled) module.
>
>
> My objection to Werner's naming convention is that I view O3 as a single
> subsystem.
> If I didn't do any web programming I would not use O3. To create many
> different
> subsystems and give them names O3baseFiles that reside in a sub
> directory O3base/Mod/Files.odc
> as compared to O3/Mod/BaseFiles.odc forces an unnecessary splitting and
> treats O3base
> as if it
> were unconnected to all of the other modules associated with O3. Why not
> just
> call it 'base', or
> 'Mybase', or 'Hotdog'? By grouping everything into a single subsystem
> 'O3' the
> intended inter-dependencies
> between the modules are explicitly revealed and maintained.
>
> Also, If I wish to delete the O3 system from my BlackBox then all that
> is needed
> using my naming
> convention is a single sub directory delete of O3, whereas with Werner's
> naming
> convention I need
> to remember that App belongs to O3 and delete it along with O3app,
> O3base, O3bb,
> O3std, O3host
> sub directories. Not as clean.
>
> -Doug Danforth
>
> On 11/23/2011 3:50 AM, о╦РП йСЬМХП wrote:
>
> Hi everyone!
>
> Douglas,
>
> By overview of O3-framework you're saying that
>
> Renamed all of your modules so that that conform to theBlackBox subsystem
> standard. Hence I now have
> O3App...
> O3Bb...
> O3Base...
> O3Host...
> O3Std...
>
> by doing that there need only be a single Code directory under O3
>
> First of all, we need to define subsystem:
>
> For the BlackBox Component Builder, it is a convention that collections
> of
> related components, called subsystems, are placed into separate
> directories;
> Keep all constituents of a component in one place.
>
> (quoted from Design Practices)
>
> Here we can see that subsystem is collection of components, not modules.
> Actually saying, if there were only modules, it would be forbidden to use
> any dependencies in your own subsytem.
>
> Thus we have "components", it takes us to a typical use-case of
> wrapping abstractions in single module of SubsystemA,
> that wraps a bunch of modules in SubsystemB.
> For example, lets take a look to a pair of Std+Host subsytem in BlackBox.
> Is there any reason to put them in a single directory?
>
> So, if you will look up for dependencies of O3-framework (not
> O3-subsystem,
> obviously)
> you will find several different layers of abstraction, that could be used
> distinctly,
> as well as in scope with other O3xxx-subsystems.
>
> Best regards, Peter Cushnir, Russia, Yaroslavl.
> P.S. Sorry for my poor English :)
>
> On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 12:15:42 +0300, Douglas G. Danforth
> <danforth{([at]})nowhere.xy
> wrote:
>
> Werner,
>
> But, but , but. I really do not want all of those sub directories
> at the same level. The sub directory App is specific to O3.
> I do not use any such sub directory for applications that I
> release customers. Each customer has his own subdirectory.
> Hence 'App' is poorly name and you are forcing me to have
> that directory under BB/. I really do not like that.
> The same goes for all of the other directories.
>
> Here is what I have done.
> Renamed all of your modules so that that conform to the
> BlackBox subsystem standard. Hence I now have
>
> O3App...
> O3Bb...
> O3Base...
> O3Host...
> O3Std...
>
> by doing that there need only be a single Code directory under O3
> and a single Symbol file directory under O3.
>
> One can also move all of the .odc files into a single Mod directory
> since their substructure is retained in their names (I have yet to do
> that).
>
> Compilation is much easier that way. I believe I have compile every file
> with that new naming convention.
>
> All of that was so I could have a single O3 subdirectory under the
> BlackBox
> home. Now I will have to modify the menus.odc file appropriately and
> worry about pointing to the html files correctly.
>
> -Doug
>
>
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Received on Thu Nov 24 2011 - 07:27:48 UTC