Re: [BLACKBOX] Seasoned Linux.

From: [at]} <Aubrey.McIntosh{>
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 18:32:25 -0600

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Fraser and Hanson wrote a retargetable C compiler in C, "lcc" if I
remember correctly. This has had a number of back ends written for
different CPUs.

Some years ago, it was possible to download an environment for the
Microsoft environment to build this system from itself.

At one time, I thought lcc was the preferred way to emit Oberon code
from C input. I have used J. Templ's OFront translator to help me
refine my thoughts on which C code does whatever I know how to express
in Oberon, for use in refining my implementation of this project.
Nonetheless, my knowledge of C is rudimentary, and the task never
seems to progress.

But my thoughts were,
1) build a C_to_Oberon translator,
2) boot the retargetable C compiler to Oberon,
3) add on the C++ language elements,
4) move it all to Component Pascal,
5) assimilate useful C source,
6) inject clean correct C back into the C community,
7) make a small boot time executive, for early adopter and other special users.

With the experience I have of completely de-compiling the SEK (Svend
Eric Knutson / Sequential Executive Kernel) from m-code some time ago,
and my initial work with the lcc compiler, I think that the resulting
Oberon code would be legal, but very low level and not easily
readable.

The resulting source could have higher level structures edited into
the source as insight becomes available, and with Oberon's speed and
strong typing, it would be fairly simple to produce correct,
equivalently safe, readable code after a couple of compile, edit
cycles.

I had great enthusiasm for just this project 10 years ago.


On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 5:54 PM, Douglas G. Danforth
<danforth{([at]})nowhere.xy
> On 1/4/2011 3:38 PM, Rex Couture wrote:
>
> I've been wondering when this discussion would take place. My
> impression is that the kernel is probably pretty good, through a combination
> of careful attention and brute force. Many of the applications, on the
> other hand, tend to crash.
>
> Is there any logical possibility of automatically converting C code,
> and possibly even the GNU/Linux base, to CP or Oberon-2? The cost of
> developing widely used operating system seems to be outrageous because the
> world seems to require overly numerous and complicated capabilities. On the
> other hand, I wonder if the cost of automated porting, and thereby improving
> the code, would be reasonable, or at least more reasonable.
>
> We know that Oberon code can be translated into C. The reverse is
> more difficult, to be sure, but is it not possible? There are some obvious
> technical obstacles, but could the required typing, etc. be supplied by an
> automated procedure? Surely it's theoretically possible because the
> required information is present. Of course, any programming errors that are
> discovered during compilation might have to be fixed by hand. Is this worth
> consideration or is it completely foolish?
>
> Rex Couture
>
> Many issues here.
> Does one have access to all the source code (including libraries)?
> Is a datum used in multiple ways, i.e. sometimes as char, sometimes as bits,
> etc
> (like the common blocks in Fortran)?
> Does one really know the intended type of a construct?
> ...
> I would love to see an automated converter from C to Oberon-2.
> If it is doable then I would assume it would be written in Coco.
>
> -Doug Danforth
>
>
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-- 
--
Aubrey McIntosh, Ph.D.
1502 Devon Circle
Austin TX 78723-1814
http://home.grandecom.net/~amcintosh/aubrey/Search/
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Received on Wed Jan 05 2011 - 01:32:25 UTC